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Sticky Learning Lunches #21: Having a Mental Health Conversation Bothers Me
Use this 4-part model of M.I.N.D to have an effective mental health conversation. This is especially important when working from home.
You Can Read the Full Transcript Below:
Nathan Simmonds:
Good afternoon. Welcome to Sticky Learning Lunches with me, Nathan Simmons. Yes, I’m really excited about it. Okay. Admittedly, I’ve been excited previously. Every day is my favorite day. We’re gonna be covering some really deep stuff, some stuff that is really personal to me, something that’s really important to me. Um, and it’s stuff that we, I think a lot of us here in some way, shape or form, have experiences in on, on either end of the equation. So we’re just waiting for the last few people to join in. I just wanna make sure I’ve got full view, seeing some regulars here, which is nice.
Nathan Simmonds:
Colin, Andy. Darren, good to see you. Good. Thank you very much for being here again. Got Matt in Vicki again, good to see you. And new faces, which I’m super excited about as well. It’s great to be sharing some of this content with some new people, sharing ideas, just giving it 30 seconds while we’re waiting for everyone to get into the room. First things first, as always, he says with this, just reminding me to be here for sticky learning. Shut that down.
Nathan Simmonds:
First things, first, phones. Let’s get your phones out. Let’s make sure they’re all on flight mode. Mine is, let’s zero out the distractions. We’re gonna be covering some serious content today, and I wanna make sure that you are giving yourself a hundred percent attention. Not just what I’m saying or what I’m sharing, or the questions that I’m asking, that you are giving yourself 100% of your attention right now as we go through this content. Okay? Next thing is making sure we’ve got drinks available. Nice cup of tea.
Nathan Simmonds:
Make sure, again, like I say, it’s reducing the distraction. So you’ve got a drink available. Phone is off, Facebook’s closed down, LinkedIn done. You haven’t got WhatsApp, pinging, buzzing, beeps, nothing. Making sure. So you’ve got your papers ready. If you’ve got a notepad available, fresh piece of paper, let’s make sure it’s the fresh page that again, you can just, uh, devote to the content of today.
Nathan Simmonds:
And at the top of that page, you’re gonna write keepers. Now, keepers are the things you wanna keep hold of. They’re the things that you want to remember. The things that you want to go back to that are going to evoke a new train of thought. So after listening to today’s content, when you go back and read those notes, it’s gonna be the things that keeps the thinking and the learning going. That’s what sticky learning is all about, making it stick. So good. I think we’re all here. I think we’re all here right now. Let’s make sure we can see everyone there. Good. So let’s get into the content today. Welcome to today’s lunchtime learning.
Nathan Simmonds:
My name is Nathan Simmons, senior leadership coach and trainer for MBM, making Business Matter, the Holistic Learning. And we are the leadership and soft skills provider to the grocery and manufacturing industry. These lunchtime learnings, these micro elements of content about helping you be the best version of you in the work that you do right now, where you are, whether you are working from home or in the office, and also preparing you for the return to work as well. So let’s get into this. What are we covering for this week? We are covering mind. We are gonna be talking about mental health. We are gonna be
Nathan Simmonds:
Helping you create the right questions and the right focuses to develop the conversations that you need to be having with your teams. Show of yeses and nos. Who here has experience of mental health? Um, I’m not sure challenges is the right word, but you know, from, from a personal point of view, who here has some, you know, concerns, challenges, questions about their own mental health and, and their own mental wellbeing? I’m one who here has got people in their teams that have some mental health, uh, conversations that need to be had. I’m mindful my language, it means different things to different people.
Nathan Simmonds:
Tough a few years back, yet tried to hide from it. Friends, certainly employers. Yeah, I do. Absolutely. So the idea of this is, let me ask a different question. How many people here have got people in your teams that are in your direct responsibility, in your gift that you know that they have some, um, they, they, they need some support around their mental health and their mental wellbeing. But you don’t know what to say. Who here is having this challenge? I do. Good. I do. Yeah.
Nathan Simmonds:
If you are gonna take one thing away from today’s training, from what, the next 15 minutes, what’s the one thing that you would like to take away from today that is gonna help you to have that conversation? Yes, but learning all the time. Our company charity is a mental Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So more companies are getting involved in this. More companies are getting involved with mental health, charity, uh, charities and organizations. First response is to be approachable. Absolutely.
Nathan Simmonds:
What else do you want? What else this is, and this is a question for everyone. What do you want to get from the next 15 minutes in order to support the conversations about mental health with your team? How to open it up. Good. To try and get my team member to be open with me when they need support tools to help just one person how to, how to spot it. Absolutely. Good. Let’s dive into this. I’ve got three key elements here that I wanna share with you and I’ve got some other stuff that I want to kind of just go through with you. Everybody has mental health.
Nathan Simmonds:
It doesn’t matter who you are or where you think you are on whatever continuum, spectrum or or framework. Everybody has mental health and a level of mental wellbeing and more businesses are talking about, which is phenomenal. The challenge is though, that just because the business is talking about it doesn’t mean that your leaders are talking about it. Does it mean that your leaders have the conversational skills to open up the conversation to actually spot it?
Nathan Simmonds:
And when they do, to actually face into it, to help the individual do what they need to do, not for themselves, but to help that person that’s in their gift, in their charge go and get the support they need to take the action for themselves. So as leaders now, the, the biggest, the biggest call out that I have as a previous leader, as someone that’s experienced mental health from both sides is that I would probably say 95 to 98% as an educated guess of leaders simply don’t know how to start the conversation.
Nathan Simmonds:
And because they’re not sure they have this level of uncertainty, it makes them nervous. It makes them reticent to actually engage in it and step over that point and get into it to find out what’s going on because they’re worried that they’ll make it worse. And in truth, the one thing that will make it worse is not actually saying anything. You can say anything to anybody as long as you do it with absolute love and respect.
Nathan Simmonds:
If you are dealing with someone that is in crisis, that has got challenges, doesn’t know what the next step is for themselves, by ignoring it, you’re actually gonna compound it. So we have to learn as leaders just to step into that and, you know, talk to people about this. Explain to them, you know what, I’m, I’m not used to this conversation. I feel nervous about having this conversation because this is very new to me.
Nathan Simmonds:
And at the same time, I want to ask you a question that’s gonna help you do what you need to do that’s gonna help improve the situa or help you to improve the thinking about the situation, whatever it might be. But I would rather have someone show me that they care, even if it was clunky or um, or nervous, at least I know they care about me ’cause they bothered to have the conversation. Yet too often we’re concerned from a HR perspective, from a leadership point of view or even a tribunal point of view.
Nathan Simmonds:
Maybe I said the wrong thing. And as I said, now you can say anything you want to someone, as long as it’s done absolute love and respect. Being rude is just being rude. Being inhumane is just being inhumane. And you cannot dress any of that up. So it’s about, first of all, making sure that we are getting clear on our own head about how we have these conversations. So this week is gonna be all about mind. The first part on mind
Nathan Simmonds:
Is mindset. It’s about helping people get clear, okay, where are they in the process? Now, the model that I’ve designed, the, uh, the framework, this first part is just helping people get back into their mind. It’s about helping them to, um, create, um, to Dees deescalate and create enough space in order to be able to have the rest of the conversation. When people are in crisis, their brains are, are working very slightly differently. It’s not incorrectly. They’re doing what they believe, what the brain believes is the right process in order to keep themselves safe.
Nathan Simmonds:
And because of a situation that’s happened, that process is then repeated time and time again. Whenever those indicators build up to that, we’ll cover that in a minute. So the first part of this around mindset is signposting. In this model, in this framework, it’s just the, the mindset part is about creating the space to help someone deescalate. Just bring the emotions back, create a center so that they can then start thinking a little bit more clearly and help ’em to, uh, move themselves forward. Whether it’s in, uh, a moment of anxiety or depression or potentially the buildup to A-P-T-S-D flashback.
Nathan Simmonds:
When we see someone starting to go into crisis, we need to get them clear on why we are there and where they’re going. We want to help just not necessarily, we want to not necessarily calm the situation. We just want to facilitate it and make it a bit more easier. So what do I mean by this? Someone goes into crisis. The first thing that I do as a mental health first aid is arriving on in the situation is getting a little bit of understanding about what’s going on, but I wanna make sure that person’s included. I don’t want to exclude them because then they’re gonna feel like they’re being talked about, which may then escalate the emotions.
Nathan Simmonds:
Tell me what’s going on. How can I help? Where, no, what’s the reason I’m here? Okay, I’m gonna hear, I’m gonna ask some questions ’cause I wanna find out what’s happening for you. I wanna find out if there’s, if there’s a right person to speak to, who we need to get to support you and, and move you into the best possible place. Is it okay that I ask you these questions that’s gonna help to improve this situation? How many people when I just asked that question just said yes in their own head and we are not even actually having a crisis situation? How many people said yes? Say I
Nathan Simmonds:
It’s a loaded question. Why? Because I want this person to understand that I’m here to help them. Yes, I’m a challenging individual. I know I pride myself on the level of change I give people and the questions I ask them. But I’m here to support you now to improve the situation. So I’m gonna ask this question ’cause I wanna find out. So what I’m using is I’m using kind of the law of affability. It’s almost like a sales technique to get that person to agree to the situation. So I’m getting ’em to come along with me.
Nathan Simmonds:
This is the first stage. So I’m gonna tell them why I’m in the conversation. Question for everyone here. Why are you in the conversation? Why are you here today? And why are you in the conversations with those people? So if someone at works having an anxiety attack or PTSD flashback or mentor, why are you joining that conversation to help? Good. And when we talk about mindset, I’m not just talking about theirs, I’m talking about yours as well
Nathan Simmonds:
And knowing why you are in the conversation to help me and others through tough times. Absolutely. If you understand your mindset in this conversation, why you are in the conversation, it’s easier for you to signpost to people, this is why I’m here, this is how I would like to help. And it’s by asking some questions. When we all, if any of you have done the first aid training, um, through Mental Health England, we’re not here to give advice. Coaches aren’t here to give advice. We’re here to ask questions to support you developing and getting where you need to be, where you want to be.
Nathan Simmonds:
So we saw post why we’re in there, and then we start finding out some more information. And from here we can find out where is the best place. Okay, where’s best for you right now? Where can we move? Can we get you to a a, an alternative location? There’s a bit more comfortable meeting room office outside, maybe some fresh air. So we start to get the information, we start to ask them questions of how to support ’em. And we start to give them a narrative. This is why I’m here.
Nathan Simmonds:
This is what I would like to do. These are the questions I’m gonna ask you. So the person goes, I know what’s coming because anxiety and these sort of elements, these initial um, raising of emotions comes from uncertainty and ambiguity. We don’t know what’s coming next. Therefore the brain goes into a certain process that starts to cause the shutdown. So when we tell people what’s going on, we start putting people back in control using certain questions. It starts to reduce the emotion development.
Nathan Simmonds:
It enables us to have a bit more of a conversation. Hope this is useful. I’m talking at speed at it because I’m conscious of time. So we’re signposting. Number two is mechanics. The reason that we are signposting is we want that person thinking to shift. The reason it shifted is any mental health diagnosis in the majority, um, or situation or um, or challenge is caused by some sort of trauma. And trauma is relative. It means different things to different people. Mm-hmm, ,
Nathan Simmonds:
I was bullied horrendously at school as a result of that, that that, that also led into to certain other behaviors later on. And that was what started my trauma. Now I’ve also worked in, in peer groups of other, of other men as well. And one of those was sex trafficked by his family members. Trauma is relative. It doesn’t diminish how we feel or or where our thinking is.
Nathan Simmonds:
One, you know what means something to one person means something different to somebody else. So nobody can devalue or depreciate how you feel about a situation and how your body or brain has chosen or, or the choice that was made to react and, and build that in as a behavior. So gotta I understand this.
Nathan Simmonds:
When you are speaking to someone in your team and they had a poor relationship with a parent or something, it may seem to you very low in the scale to them know it’s everything. So we need to be clear on this. And again, we need to ask the questions just to help them to understand what they can do about it. What charity organizations, um, whether they can get support, whether it’s EAP, all these sorts of things.
Nathan Simmonds:
So the mechanics here starts to shift as we start to go into a stress reaction from part of our brain starts to shut down. And we start to move into kind of the, the more primordial parts of the brain, the primitive parts of the brain, the amygdala, where the fear facts, um, um, elements work from where the emotions come from. And down in here is where emotion is built, but not language.
Nathan Simmonds:
Up here is where language is built, but not emotion. So as the top part of the brain starts to just ba um, to to, um, to stop working, we go into the lower parts of the brain, which are all about emotions but not language. So we we’re not able to articulate ourselves very well. We’re not able to get our thoughts across clearly. Has anyone been out on a weekend and they’ve seen a fight starting, you know, in the pub or the club? Have you ever noticed how the people getting in the fight start to only use words with one syllable? And I’m not asking for examples by the way,
Nathan Simmonds:
When you know this. It’s because this the logical part, the language part, the brain is starting to close down when aren’t, you know, when we’re having a um, an episode of some sort that’s also starting to happen. We go into the stress reaction, we go into the four Fs, the fight, flight, flock or freeze. So our our um, our habits and our instincts take over and it’s just simply our brain doing its best it can to keep us alive. The challenge is your brain can’t differentiate between a job interview or a saber-tooth tiger. You can’t tell the difference. They’re both equally as dangerous according to that primordial part, the amygdala.
Nathan Simmonds:
So when we start to do this, we need to be aware of the reason why we’re signposting is ’cause we know the person’s brain has started to shift focus. It’s working completely normally it’s just started to shift focus. So we need to signpost it people to let them know that we are here to support them, that we are not a threat because we need to understand that your brain or our brains are playing tricks on us. So we have to play tricks on it to help that person get where they need to be.
Nathan Simmonds:
Hope this is making sense with everyone. Let me know in the question box that we moving on to the next bit. What’s been useful so far from today? I’ve still got one more point that I’m gonna drop in with you in just two seconds. What’s been useful so far?
Nathan Simmonds:
The fight part where people use one word that makes sense absolutely. As I was doing at the beginning of this conversation, this structure for conversations really, really useful. Good. It’s about them feeling safe to participate. Absolutely. We are creating psychological safety to understand that we’re only there to facilitate and signposting good. And we’re using the questions, which is what I was already doing at the beginning part of the conversation.
Nathan Simmonds:
How many people here have got this? How many people have got experience of this? Okay, engage in the conversation. What’s the reason you are here signpost to people, this is how I’m gonna help you. Where would be best for you? I’m bringing them in, getting permission to help and support them. Absolutely. Reminder that job interview and tiger. Not different. Absolutely. So we are using the questions. Your brain is a validation machine. I will express this a million times until I die.
Nathan Simmonds:
I believe I got this from Tony Robbins. Your brain is a validation machine. Whatever question you put into your brain, it will create an answer. It doesn’t matter whether you know it is true, you got it from east enders, your mom from the dictionary, doesn’t matter. Whatever question you ask, your brain will create a response and that’s what it’s there to do.
Nathan Simmonds:
It’s a validation machine checking to make sure what I’m moving towards is, is pleasurable and life-affirming and moving away from things that are dangerous, painful and death. And that that’s the only two relevant reference points it’s got. Especially at this pri primordial part. We use questions to control the focus and help ’em to focus their control.
Nathan Simmonds:
So when we are doing this, and this is, you know, where the the the the mental health coaching cue cards came from is in the beginning of that coaching deck, there is a raft of questions for mind, for mind for the mindset element used from CBT techniques, deescalation techniques where we want to bring people out from this area high up in the brain, like no out of their own heads ’cause they’re not thinkingly and bringing them back into their center, into their body to control their senses and get that now that space and to actually get a sense of feeling back.
Nathan Simmonds:
You ever notice when you start to become highly emotional, you start becoming aware of things when you’re really, really stressed, the blood pressure build builds up and you can’t hear anything or you can’t feel certain things. It’s ’cause your thinking has escalated to a point where your body functions are starting to shut down because you’re pumping so much adrenaline through your system.
Nathan Simmonds:
So what we wanna do is we wanna bring people back to their senses. One technique is tell me something you can see. Tell me something you can feel, um, tell me something that you can smell. So we’re bringing people back consciously to their senses. One thing we did recently or I learned and I also applied it with my own daughter recently is play the rainbow game. Tell me something you can see that’s blue.
Nathan Simmonds:
So you’re getting people to use logical parts of their brain to associate color with objects. So it’s just starting to pump blood back to the front part of the brain to help them apply logic and reengage the thinking with our daughter. My daughter was having a meltdown. We’re in lockdown right now, this is week seven or whatever. We’re in a crisis situation. Sometimes the emotions get really high.
Nathan Simmonds:
Daughter having a meltdown is tired, she’s seven. All these elements. I said ah, let’s play the rainbow game. And she was like, the what? And even playing saying let’s play the rainbow game was enough to snap her out of that for a moment. And I said, okay, this is something we, a technique that we use. Tell me something you can see this with. Ah, all of a sudden the attention shifted very quickly because she hasn’t got the the complexities of so-called nuances of adult life to cloud that. But she was instantly into the rainbow game and in fact she wanted to play it twice.
Nathan Simmonds:
So what we’re doing is we’re giving people focal points to look at. We’re getting ’em to think about how their body feels. How does it feel when you breathe deeply? So again, we’re getting the logical part of the brain to associate to something else to then concentrate that. What do you think of that causes calm? What do you think of that helps you to breathe slowly? It just starts to form in the brain. Breathing starts to slow down and we reinforce it ’cause we’ve told them why we are here and we understand the mechanics. We’re then able to ask certain questions that control the focus, that get that person to focus themselves.
Nathan Simmonds:
As we start to do that, we understand that the breathing starts to drop down, the heart rate starts to slow down and then we can have a different part of the conversation when we look at the mind framework. Next part is importance and then network and then direction. You cannot go to the next train station on this journey until you’ve got this first part, uh, right in the, in the best possible place.
Nathan Simmonds:
If I start walking in knowing that in 15 different questions, I dunno who I am, I dunno why I am, um, I’m trying to find out who their best friend is. I’m trying to tell them what to do, which is not the right thing to do in, in a mental health situation. They’re not gonna deescalate, they’ll never hear you because they’re not getting back into their own senses and they’re not able to use the, the logical part of the brain.
Nathan Simmonds:
So we use the questions just to bring it down. Let’s go, let’s recap on this time signpost narrative. Tell them why you are in the conversation. And you guys need to know why you are in the conversation and for whose benefit is. Find out why they’re in this situation. Find out where yours and their mindset is and give them a narrative as to what you’re bringing. Understand the the headline mechanics of what’s going on here.
Nathan Simmonds:
And then start to ask the right questions to help bring that person down into their body, back into their senses to help them then be able to get some more clarity and more headway in the situation. Hope today’s been useful, please. What’s been useful? Now, I know some of you guys have just shared some bits in there. What are you taking away from today’s session? What have you written down in your keepers about today’s 20 minutes that is gonna help you do a better job as a leader in your team’s building, um, skills and mental health with your guys?
Nathan Simmonds:
Love the rainbow. Thank you. As those responses are coming in link in the chat box, mental health coaching cards. They are five pound. It takes you through the mind model step by step to help you ask the right questions, better questions to support yourself and your teams and your businesses to help your focuses as as too, you know, shifting focuses.
Nathan Simmonds:
Absolutely link in the chat box now. If you haven’t got a copy of the mental health coaching card, get them. They are gonna be an absolute godsend for those leaders that are moving into this space. What do we got here? Shifting. Focus Better to say something, ask something even if it’s clunky, rather than ignore it and wait for them to raise it. Absolutely. And you know what? Even asking or saying, do you know what? I observed this. I I felt like something’s not right.
Nathan Simmonds:
What’s going on for you? How are you today? Just showing people that you care will be the start, uh, structured approach. Never thought before about narrative or questions that will help brilliant the rainbow. Questioning, calming, re-engage and shifting the folk absolutely affirmed previous know. Nice. So good. Brad, I’m glad you’ve got the knowledge. Keep building it and practice it and share it with other people as well. Emotional part of brain and getting into rational part of the brain.
Nathan Simmonds:
Absolutely they need to work together now. You can’t have one without the other rainbow. Simple and easy. Absolutely change the focus. Be clear on why I’m getting involved. Absolutely. When people know why you are in the conversation, they will engage with you because they understand what you are bringing. They understand that they are the most important person in the conversation. Um, even when you’re looking at, um, giving feedback or coaching. Uh, and at MBM we talk about the don’t shout campaign when we’re giving feedback is who is the most important person in the conversation?
Nathan Simmonds:
Whenever you are giving feedback, coaching or supporting someone else in a mental health situation, who is the most important person in the conversation? When you get this clear in your head, it’s easier for you to articulate it to other people so they actually believe it. And as a result of that they’ll go, okay, I will listen to you. I will get help from you. I understand that you are here to support me. And then you can ask the next lot of questions that’s gonna help them to progress down that journey to get where they need to be. Hope this is useful. What questions have you got for me right now? What questions have you got for me that I might be able to help with or direct you to?
Nathan Simmonds:
And just while we’re there, one thing I forgot to say, everybody, the link for tomorrow’s session is in the chat box right now. If you have not registered, do that immediately. As soon as this finishes register for tomorrow’s session. Uh, make sure you’re in for tomorrow as well. Uh, I’m super keen for you to get all these skill sets and these understandings. A sign of someone that is struggling. There are lots.
Nathan Simmonds:
Um, the thing is, the signs of someone struggling is look for the signs that aren’t normal. It look is is when you get to know people, what is off, what is out of, um, out of turn, um, what is suspicious but not looking to catch them, getting it wrong. Looking to see actually does this fit with their normal character. You know, I’m a very results focused, driven, goal orientated individual. I become quieter when I’m, when my emotions become higher, I become quieter and quieter.
Nathan Simmonds:
And that’s often a trigger. Um, some people will get angry and agitated and they will push because they want to get a reaction. ’cause it’s, they’re making a bid for connection. So it’s just looking to see what is, what’s right or wrong, what doesn’t feel normal. If it’s out of turn, then there’s something else that needs to be looked at. When will the cards arrive? Have audit, but yes, they’re on their way. I’ll get a message to you shortly.
Nathan Simmonds:
What is the five Fs? Four Fs, four Fs, fight, flight, flock or freeze. Yes. Fight, flight, flock or freeze. Normally they talk about fight or flight. But actually if you look in nature, you’ll see fight and flight is the normal primitive reactions. Not a natural reaction, but you’ve also got flock and freeze. So you’ll see animals that actually will freeze because the brain of most creatures is designed for movement and novelty.
Nathan Simmonds:
Actually some animals will freeze ’cause they know that actually look at a sticking insect. If it doesn’t move, it doesn’t get eaten. Block is when actually people gather together. They feel safe more, more they feel safety in numbers. They gather together. You’ll see people in the office congregate around the printer, uh, and complain about the new, um, process that’s being in inflicted on them. They feel better coming together to complain about it.
Nathan Simmonds:
They don’t do anything about it. They just go back to wherever they were working. The four refs, fight, flight, flock, freeze, the opening line. Should you start, start with your observations. Absolutely can do. I saw this. This is what I’ve observed. Um, you know, I’m, I’m, I’m, I’d like to have a conversation. I’d, I’d like to find out more about what’s going on ’cause I care about you.
Nathan Simmonds:
Um, when approaching conversations and mental health first aid, do you follow the algae model asking about suicide first, I don’t necessarily need to ask about the suicide first. I do follow the algae model. So I wanna assess what’s going on, first of all. And I wanna listen. And that assessment and listening for me comes from coaching questions. I’m not here to give advice depending where they are. I’m kind of depression.
Nathan Simmonds:
Mental health is asking what’s the plan? That’s normally the question, you know, if, if you have a concern about, so I’m really concerned about this, uh, the more questions you gotta ask and the more you clearly you signposted, the more they will engage with you and the more they will offer you and give you. Now someone says, I’m thinking about, and you know, it’ll probably be in their choice of language, uh, committing suicide, committing and completing two very different, um, thinking process is our case.
Nathan Simmonds:
So what’s the plan without any judgment, with just absolute curiosity to support this person. What’s the plan? Because it’s not something that we decide and wake up in the morning and, and, and doodle on the back of a fag packet is that there’s a serious thinking process that goes behind this.
Nathan Simmonds:
What if they don’t recognize they’re struggling? Huge. Um, a phrase that I heard recently in the last week or so was high functioning depression, which is something I believe that I’ve lived with for quite large quantities of my life. And I didn’t recognize I was struggling. You know, people don’t, until they get to a breaking point where their stress part is so full that actually the lid, it comes off and then there’s a problem.
Nathan Simmonds:
So as leaders, it’s important that we actually engage with people and give people different structures and, and and viewpoints to help them build on that. Rather than going in and trying to do some sort of negotiation, say, oh, I see you’re struggling. And the person goes, yeah, thanks. You know, you see I’m struggling. You make the person feel inferior or, um, less of a human or, or less cared about or whatever.
Nathan Simmonds:
Or less capable because we’re pointing that out and I say, do you know what? I’ve observed this and I’d like to find out what the thinking is behind that. What’s happening for you? Where, where’s this approach come from? What’s the logic behind this? I want to, I want to provide some other frameworks and structures here. We don’t have to necessarily talk about your mental health, you know, your tolerance level, your stress, but no, no. What’s the thinking behind this?
Nathan Simmonds:
And actually we could help as leaders to maybe redirect a, a process that makes ’em feel more comfortable and more capable to do that. And also you’ve made yourself approachable. I saw this, I wanna get the logic behind that and really understand what’s causing that. And you make yourself more approachable to the individual so that they can actually, they, they will see you as a person for guidance and they’re catching them getting it right.
Nathan Simmonds:
We’re offering ways and opportunities to develop hope that helps. Uh, if you can’t get a connection with the person, don’t give up even though it’s a third, even through a third party, absolutely have the conversations. And it is, I think it’s the same with coaches and mentors and trainers. There will always be someone that is a best fit for that individual. There’ll be certain things that I’m better equipped to deal with.
Nathan Simmonds:
And actually while I’m in that it might say, do you know what? Actually let’s have a look. Look at this. This might be the best person that speak to you might need to speak to hr. You might need to speak to this charity organization. Whatever it is, find those people and then just check in with them. You know, it is up to them to take the next steps. You know, you can’t give advice.
Nathan Simmonds:
You can seek experts though and you know, it’s just ha building up the conversation over a course of time. They may not be ready to have the conversation with your first time ’cause they’ve only just met you. And actually as a result of this, they may not open up completely, but you just keep offering the, the, the different ways of working to help them build up their skillset.
Nathan Simmonds:
And as they can see that you are approachable, personable, caring, supportive, they will then bring more conversation to you so that you can have more of that conversation. So that fingers crossed you don’t get into a potentially crisis situation, that person will come and speak to you before as you escalates to that point. Hope this is useful everybody. Thanks very much for the date. I’m conscious of time. We’re six minutes over. Apologies for that. I’m very respectful of your time.
Nathan Simmonds:
A lot of content to cover. I hope this has been useful. They’ve got some links in there for other charity organizations as well. So if you’ve got more questions about this or you’ve got concerns, you’re going to, we’ve got heads together down there as well. So we’ve got a link into them so you can get more information from them as well about different elements on mental health and support mechanisms.
Nathan Simmonds:
Tomorrow we’re gonna go into the eye of mind, which is about, um, importance, where the focus is, uh, and how you can help people to shift that focus that you can help ’em to step out of what they’re looking at, look at it from a different angle and build up the skills and momentum to actually improve the situation. Liz, you’re very welcome. Really appreciate the, the thanks on that everybody. Hope you have a lovely day. Hope this has been useful.
Nathan Simmonds:
I look forward to seeing you here tomorrow. Please make sure you are registered, get your seat ’cause it’s great to have some questions with you. Thanks very much for the day everyone. Thanks you.
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